Photographer unknown – if you took this photo please go to the copyright page.
Samuel Ledgard Ltd 1948 AEC Regent III Roberts H30/26R
This bus started life with another independent operator, Felix Motors of Hatfield near Doncaster and was number 26 in there fleet, it was new to them in 1948 and was sold on to Samuel Ledgard in 1962. Samuel Ledgard were different to other bus operators in the fact that they did not have fleet numbers, I don’t know why, maybe you do? if you do please leave a comment. If you want to know what the livery of Samuel Ledgard looked like there is a colour shot here This bus has a Roberts body of which I know absolutely nothing, and the only thing that comes up on “Google” is as quoted below which is from the Lincolnshire Vintage Vehicle Society website regarding Colchester Corporation Daimler CVD6 No. 4, if you know anything about Roberts bodies please leave a comment.
“Roberts were an unusual choice of bus body builder – they were more commonly associated with railway vehicles and occasional trams. The body is unusually heavy – weighing about half a ton more than most buses of similar size. This affected the fuel consumption of these vehicles and may have been a factor in the decision to cancel the second batch of five” To see more regarding the above quote go here
Bus tickets issued by this operator can be viewed here.
Charles Roberts of Wakefield built this and many other bodies, including Sheffield’s last trams and Blackpool’s Coronation cars.
John Hibbert
“It is no wonder that the Roberts bodies were so heavy as the quality, both in structure and in fittings, was of the very highest. They also managed to present a comforting vintage appearance and ambience but without looking “old fashioned.” Superb varnished woodwork was everywhere, and the top quality heavy leather seats were of the best. GWY 157 was a fine machine but ended its Ledgard career rather strangely allocated to Yeadon Depot – normally a lowbridge stronghold – and therefore only realistically available for school journeys avoiding Henshaw Lane. Why there was never a fleet numbering scheme I have no idea, but certainly the firm managed very well without one. Any confusion was normally avoided by allocating vehicles with similar registrations to different depots – there were quite a few cases of this over the years. However, in the run up to the West Yorkshire takeover most of the fleet were allocated fleet numbers before the last minute decision was taken to re-licence many of West Yorkshire’s own withdrawn vehicles instead. For example, PNW 91/2/3 were to be DLW 1/2/3, the RTs were to be DA 1-34 etc etc. What a shame this never came to be!!
Chris Youhill
New 1/9/48 AEC Regent III 0961 Chassis No: 1684 Entered Ledgard fleet 19/01/62
Terry Malloy
Although it was unusual for a bus company not to use fleet numbers, I seem to recall that East Kent Road Car also managed to operate successfully without them. Presumably staff simply referred to their buses by the digits on the registration plates?
Brendan Smith
26/03/11 – 07:25
Burton upon Trent Corporation operated 6 Guy Arab 111 5LW’s with lowbridge Roberts bodies, delivered 1947. See photograph on p51 May 2009 issue of Vintage Roadscene. These vehicles also had heavy leather seating and varnished interior timber trim – painted over by the Corporation mid 50’s. They developed a sagging roofline quite early in their lives.
Kingston upon Hull Corporation Transport 1953 AEC Regent III Weymann “AuroRa” H32/26R
Regent III I hear you shout, yes I thought it was a Daimler as well, until Paul Morfitt a K.H.C.T. expert pointed it out to me. K.H.C.T. bought 6 of these Regent IIIs with the Birmingham style tin front, they were apparently the last front engine/open platform buses bought brand new by them. Fleet number 337 is now fully preserved and should be out on the rally circuit next summer (2010) so keep your eye out for it. There is also a restored Bradford City Transport Regent III with a similar tin front it can be seen here.
04/04/13 – 06:28
The Weymann Aurora body is something of an enigma. The first one – also co-incidentally on an AEC Regent III with tin front – was built for Devon General and exhibited on the MCW stand at Earls Court in 1952 alongside the prototype Orion. An MCW sales brochure was produced, which was still being distributed two years later, but no more bodies of that type were ever built. In the meantime Weymann had been building this much more elegant design, which most people agree bears no resemblance to the prototype described in the brochure, and which could instead be traced back much more clearly to earlier Weymann bodies. It is almost as though Weymann simply thumbed its nose at the MCW design team and just carried on with their own design evolution as if nothing had happened. To confuse matters still further, a brief article in a recent edition of Classic Bus magazine, describing the prototype (which is now preserved) as unique, it was answered by not one but two letters referring to production Auroras as “virtually identical” to the prototype – one of them referring to these Hull vehicles and the other I think to some Bristols for Maidstone and District. It seems that resemblance, like beauty, is in the eye of the beholder!
Peter Williamson
04/04/13 – 08:29
The Aurora is certainly an enigma – and a trap for those who only know half the story. I too have been puzzled by the lack of similarity between to prototype and production versions but the Weymann Story (in two volumes Senior/Venture) is very clear. The Aurora name was used for these modernised versions of the classic Weymann design (produced from 1953 to 1959). The MCCW Orion design was produced at Addlestone from about 1953 (the first being re-bodies of war time Guys for Maidstone & District). Interestingly, Addlestone were also building Aurora bodies on war time Bristols for M & D. What most people didn’t realise – me included – is that the Aurora name was then resurrected as the official and proper name for the forward entrance version on the Orion.
David Oldfield
04/04/13 – 11:03
Just remembered the Bournemouth trolleys which had the Aurora as late as 1962.
David Oldfield
04/04/13 – 11:04
Here is a photo of the preserved one-off 1952 Aurora, Devon General NTT 679, taken at the Devon General Running Day at Newton Abbott in 1993.
John Stringer
04/04/13 – 15:49
The main difference between the prototype Aurora and the production model seems to be the move from pan window fixing to rubber mounting.
Here is an example of the production version as supplied to Birkenhead Corporation in 1954. Apart from being on an exposed radiator chassis, it differs from the Hull version in having a 5-bay body. The traditional Weymann drooping saloon window is much in evidence. Birkenhead dabbled with Weymann as a body supplier. The batch of 10 Auroras was not the whole of the CBG intake, the remaining 5 of the batch having locally-built Ashcroft bodies. The 1955 intake of 17 vehicles (10 PD2 and 7 Arab IV) saw half the PD2s bodied with the Orion style, and finally in 1964 came the one-off batch of 10 Fleetlines, again with Orion style, one of which appears on the left of the picture. (Originally delivered with the cream relief as window surrounds only, the appearance of the Fleetlines was much improved with the application of the standard livery on repaint, as seen here.)
Alan Murray-Rust
05/04/13 – 05:51
To me there are more differences than similarities. On the prototype, the dimensions of the windows – deep lower, shallow upper – are more like a production Orion than any other Aurora (and the deep lower deck windows were made much of in the sales brochure). On the production version, as Alan says, the traditional Weymann drooping bulkhead window is much in evidence, whereas on the prototype the top rail is straight and only the bottom curved, again just like most highbridge Weymann Orions. In fact the only similarities I can find (using other images) are in the front and rear domes and the rear emergency window.
Peter Williamson
23/04/13 – 07:50
My favourite bus, thin steering wheel and a smooth seat which you could slide off on exit from a roundabout and if it was a hot day and your cab door was open it could be interesting. A lot of drivers didn’t like them because you couldn’t see the pavement from the cab. I thought they were great, the exhaust would roar when you put your foot down.
box501
03/06/14 – 12:52
The Daimler and Guy Utilities of Maidstone and District were rebodied with a later form of five bay Weymann body derived from the pre and early post war design but with deeper windows upstairs. Only some Utility Bristol K6As had four bay ‘Aurora’ or five bay ‘Orion’ bodies. The only Orion bodied Guys which Maidstone and District had, were the Guy Arab IVs acquired or ordered by Chatham and District which were based on new post war chasses.
Photographer unknown – if you took this photo please go to the copyright page.
Halifax Corporation Transport and Joint Omnibus Committee 1951 AEC Regent III Park Royal H30/26R
This Regent III of Halifax corporation is parked outside The Shay football ground probable waiting to take fans back to the town centre, but as I can not see the driver or conductor perhaps they have gone to the match. This bus has the same triangular destination area as the previous Daimler CV which was new in 1954 so the new layout of a separate number box above the destination came about for the 1956 batch of Daimlers.
Sheffield Corporation 1954 AEC Regent III Weymann H32/26R
I must admit that I have come up with the above information on a bit of a wing and a prayer after searching Google and my regular informative web sites I think I am right. But if I am wrong I will not be upset if you correct me, please leave a comment. I am not sure about a white livery for buses especially in large towns they have a tendency to look a bit dirty “all the time”.
Part of the batch of 36, these were the last exposed radiator buses for Sheffield Corporation and JOC. There were preceded, in 1953/54, by over 50 Leyland PD2s, with near identical bodies, which were the first of hundreds of tram-replacement buses.
West Riding Automobile 1951 AEC Regent III Roe L50R
Another bus from the large West Yorkshire independent this time an AEC Regent III. West Riding did not favour any particular make of vehicle they had various models from each of AEC, Leyland, Daimler and Guy. How much nicer this bus would have looked with a shiny radiator instead of a painted one.
I don’t know who the photographer was but the location is Pontefract Bus Station. The bus is on the 192 service to Selby, which ran every two hours and which I caught home from school. The route was taken over from Bullock’s (B&S Motor Service) in 1950.
Del
Although the date of acquisition is 1951, the painted radiator may be a hangover from the Bullock and Sons takeover in 1950, as all their vehicles had painted radiators. West Riding also generally kept the buses acquired from B&S on the former B&S routes. An interesting feature about this vehicle was the passenger seat design. The double seats, at least in the lower saloon, had a kind of staggered design to allow easy access to the window seat.
TC
The bus is most likely to have been allocated to the former B & S depot at Chimes Road, Selby which was demolished in the late 1990s and replaced with the present new one near the railway station. I did a fair amount of work out of both premises until retiring (from Pontefract depot) in May 2001 – I did many a trip on the modern version of this route and, although the Selby fleet was interesting and well maintained, never with a vehicle as delightful as the one shown.
Chris Youhill
09/06/11 – 08:43
This bus is not ex B&S the fleet number is too high it is one of batch of 10 and was allocated to Featherstone depot, at the time of this photo. as to the radiator if you look at photos of ex B&S AEC Regents they have chrome radiators AHL 927 fleet number 295 is a good example of this (can be seen in David W Allen’s book West Riding 2 page 71
Stan
28/10/11 – 16:20
Further to my last comment this bus was new to West Riding, in 1952, a full two years after they bought B&S so impossible to be ex B&S
Stan
28/10/11 – 16:26
I quite agree Stan, BBF 9 as the ex B&S Regents as BHL 641-3 and BHL 926 – 319-22 built in 1948
Peter
09/12/12 – 07:56
An excellent book called West Riding 1 in the Super Prestige range by David W Allen has nearly all West Riding bus and coach photographs in including several A.E.C centre entrance double deckers in both red and green livery. I worked at Belle Isle depot as an apprentice from 1956 and often travelled into the City centre on one of these fine machines. The pre select gearbox made them quick off the mark and ideal for city work because of the twin staircase and wide entrance.
Barrie Micklethwaite
09/12/12 – 11:43
Barrie – your last observation is so very true even though it applies to a totally different era, but quick loading was as important then as it OUGHT to be now. The Industry has completely lost the plot nowadays, admittedly partly “pushed” by such things as buggy accessibility etc. Towards the end of my career as a driver, and still as a passenger, I despair at the impossibility of present designs with a single doorway and the buggy/wheelchair bay right opposite the bottom of the staircase. Add to this the “double standard” operator publicity to “remain seated until the vehicle stops” by managements who know full well that if all passengers did so, in both saloons, the peak period buses would still be out after Midnight. I must make clear that I am all in favour of good and sympathetic service for the passengers (and these modern “customers” whoever they are !!) but there are only sixty minutes in the hour. I have a wide experience of trying to keep time with single doorway buses and, due to resolutely refusing ever to drive badly, I was frequently late on busy journeys and man enough to shoulder all the resultant sneering and abuse from all quarters. Knowing full well that I could put up a good verbal defence on this issue the Management were never brave enough to tackle me about it and, had they done so, they would have been shot down in factual and statistical flames !! Just in conclusion, notice how multiple doorways in London and on the Continent keep the bus moving, and all the much hyped nonsense about serious passenger accidents are wildly exaggerated – that’s not to deny that extra diligence from drivers is essential on such vehicles.
Chris Youhill
05/10/14 – 11:07
With reference to the AEC double decker, I used conduct on the Selby route when I started there in 1962 ,it started at Halfpenny Lane Pontefract on the odd hour went via Pontefract bus station to Selby, but the other buses Leyland PD1 and 2s and old Guys and Guy Arabs used to operate on the 192 Selby run.
Les Cranswick
06/10/14 – 16:45
TC – Noting your comment on the ‘staggered’ double seat design, I wonder whether this was in fact another example of the Sidil Morsat experimental seat of the period.
Photographer unknown – if you took this photo please go to the copyright page.
Hebble Motor Services 1952 AEC Regent III Willowbrook L55R
This is one of the last batch of Regent IIIs Hebble took delivery of, to say it was new in 1952 it looks as if it was built well before that. I think it is the drivers sloping small window that makes it look older. Although from what I can gather the Willowbrook bodywork had excellent interior finish.
15/08/11 – 13:20
This batch or Regents were type 9612A (A=crash gears) which was a change from the previous Roe bodied Regents which were type 9612E (E=epicyclic pre-selector). I remember them on the Joint Bradford-Huddersfield route 64
Photographer unknown – if you took this photo please go to the copyright page.
Felix Motors Ltd (Hatfield) 1953 AEC Regent III Roe H31/25R
Felix motors was started in 1921 the company was named after “Felix the Cat” a cartoon character of the time, for some time the cartoon image was used as an emblem on the side of the vehicles. I have seen a photograph on the web somewhere of one of there vehicles showing the Felix logo if I find it again I will update with a link to it.
The other Felix company in Derbyshire also used Felix as a logo but were recently threatened with legal action by the film company which owns the rights so it has now been dropped. Both Felix companies used similar liveries but the Derby one has as far as I know always used saloons
Chris Hough
Absolutely right Chris – you will find a Willebrew ticket from Felix (N Frost) of Stanley Derbyshire, on the tickets side of the website.
Stephen Ford
06/12/11 – 06:47
I wrote a book about the ‘other’ Felix a few years ago and it would appear that both of company histories shared a similar beginning. ‘My’ Felix started in 1921 and was named after a popular song of the day – Felix kept on walking. The first vehicle R 7831 which carried a cartoon cat emblem over the front window was sold to the above Felix in 1926 (it was suggested that this was why the Hatfield based company was named Felix but I never found any proof of this). Sadly it has just been reported that Felix (Stanley, Derbyshire) is to cease on 29th January 2012 after being taken over by TrentBarton – the local large bus company. Hope this is of interest.
Paul D Chambers
30/10/12 – 05:57
Felix in Stanley Derbyshire are now showing ‘Black Cat’ on the side, but are run by Trent/Barton.
John Swan
07/10/13 – 17:38
I recall seeing Felix buses in Doncaster but had no idea of the origin of the name. I suppose I assumed it was the proprietor’s name or else the Latin for “happy”! Early on Felix ran some Leyland Tigers but no others from the Leyland “zoo”, being mainly an AEC operator.
Geoff Kerr
08/10/13 – 07:39
Geoff – somewhere, in an article long ago, there appears a magnificent lady driver in WW2 just climbing elegantly into the cab of a prewar Felix Regent in Doncaster. She is dressed in a long white smock and sports a very chic 1930s hat and, if I remember rightly, a long skirt in lieu of the usual slacks.
Chris Youhill
08/10/13 – 12:51
She was clearly ‘doing her bit, don’t ya know! A change from driving the Rolls, what with the fuel rationing!”
Huddersfield Corporation 1955 AEC Regent III East Lancs L30/28R
The AEC Regent III (Provincial Type) as opposed to (RT Type) was in production from 1947-56 I’m not sure how many were built but they were extremely popular if anybody knows let me know. Like the Regent II there was only one version of the first Regent IIIs that were produced they had a 9.6 litre oil engine, air operated preselective gearbox and air brakes. It wasn’t long though before the 7.7 litre engine, crash or synchromesh gearbox and if the bus had one of these gearboxes it had triple servo vacuum brakes. The early ones also had chromium plated radiators but round about 1951 they changed to cast aluminium. The Regent III was an excellent work horse, very reliable and long lasting 20-25 years service was the norm but quite a lot did much longer than that, after main service a lot were sold off to do even more service with other operators definitely one of the best buses built.
Photograph M. J. Halstron
Vehicle sited in St. Augustine Florida Nov 2009. It’s gained a red livery and is being made to masquerade as a London bus. It’s in a very run down state and seems unlikely to ever be road worthy again. Below is a photograph of her now
J. Halston
08/12/12 – 09:33
How sad to see these lovely buses left to rot, should be sent home to us.
Photo by “unknown” if you took this photo please go to the copyright page.
Leigh Corporation 1948 AEC Regent III Roberts L27/26R
Another shot of a Leigh Corporation AEC Regent III there was one on stand last April the shot was in colour too you can see it here. This Regent is four years older and was built by a different body builder Roberts of Wakefield in Yorkshire. In 1948 the overall length was 26ft it wasn’t until 1950 the length changed to 27ft although I can’t see one foot making all that much difference, touch more legroom perhaps.
05/11/13 – 10:21
The shot of a No.26 Manchester – Leigh (1965) brings back memories, I used to see this in Swinton (top of Worsley Road/Chorley Road junction) in the late 50s/early 60s. Happy memories of travelling to Golborne (trainspotting) on summer Saturday mornings. Via Worsley (under the wires), then across the East Lancs Road again via Boothstown. Change at Leigh for the 46 or 47 for Warrington, (Have I remembered correctly, can anyone confirm?), we arrived at the roundabout on the East Lancs. Road from the North (does anybody know the route it took please?) before jumping off at the roundabout risking life and limb to leg it up to the railway life just to miss a semi. 8 hours, several Shippam’s paste butties and a bottle of Tizer later it was time to go home, full of stolen peas from the adjoining field and very sweaty and grubby. Happy days. I pity the young of today.
Ron Ollerenshaw
28/03/14 – 07:08
Yes you are right about the service numbers. Both departed Leigh via Lords Street turning right at Butts Bridge the down Warrington Road to the East lances Road. The the 46 went to Warrington via Risley and Padgate and the 47 via Croft and Winwick. But you are wrong if you think that’s Golborne. Golborne is 3 to 3.5 miles down the East Lancs Road towards Liverpool. I’ve worked on the buses for the last 40 years starting in 1975 at Leigh.
Mel Higson
30/03/14 – 14:12
Thanks for the response. So what bus did I get?? Definitely out of Leigh, definitely jumped off on the East Lancs Road about a 100 yards from the West Coast main line. Ron Ollerenshaw.
Ron Ollerenshaw
23/05/16 – 06:05
Ron, I also used to trainspot in the early/mid-60’s but a bit further down, at Stones Crossing in Newton-le-Willows, where the WCML passed under the Liverpool-Manchester line. However if you spotted as you say, where the WCML passed under the A580 East Lancashire Road then that would be in Golborne. From Leigh you would have taken the 57 Wigan service via Lowton,Lane Head & Golborne Centre or the less frequent 58 via Plank Lane & Derby Road Housing Estate to Golborne Centre. These services then unusually did a double run up to the A580 roundabout to turn back to Golborne Centre, then on to Wigan or back to Leigh. That timing point was called Golborne, Park Road and was almost at the junction of the A573 with the East Lancs roundabout. Later on, in the mid 60’s the services turned in a small loop outside the Queen Anne Hotel instead of going up to the East Lancs roundabout. Although 57 & 58 were nominally LUT/Leigh Corp. jointly operated, and did so, only Leigh Corp. operated on the 58, which was a pretty sparse service, every 2 hours, with the extension to Wigan only on Saturday pm and just one through to Wigan late pm on a Sunday. The joint 57 was always hourly though. The Park Road bus stop was just yards from the East Lancs Road /WCML overbridge as you say, so this could be the location, and I feel pretty sure there would be peas in the adjoining fields though I doubt the scarecrows would have bothered you! Yes, happy sweaty, grubby days with Shippams paste butty bits floating in your bottle of Tizer or Jusoda. Take me Back!
David Smith
23/05/16 – 11:12
We used to have Seniors fish/meat paste, probably because it was made just down the road from where I lived near Wimbledon. Shippams was made at Chichester, if memory serves.
Chris Hebbron
24/05/16 – 06:59
Well really Chris, I was expecting a comment about Leigh Corporation bus services or Britannia Pacifics and ‘Jubs’, not a discourse on the merits or attributes of 1960’s fish pastes. It obviously caught your imagination! By the way, Sutherlands and Princes were yet another two manufacturers….
Midland General Omnibus Company 1948 AEC Regent III Weymann H30/26R
From what I can make out there was the Midland General Group which included Midland General obviously, Mansfield & District and Notts & Derby. One thing I find strange is that they purchased Bristol manufactured buses I thought that after 1948 only nationalised bus operators could do that. Although one thing I found out was that the general manager of the Midland General Group was also the general manager of the Lincolnshire Road Car Company which was a nationalised operator. One interesting point is that Midland General had their initials in place of the AEC badge on the radiator as can be seen in the blow up below.
This is Mount Street bus station, Nottingham. This is a pre-selector, and as I remember, it was quite unusual for them to be used on the C5 (and B3) Alfreton routes – more usually the crash gearbox Regent IIs. Even up to the late 1960s when the main service was run by Lodekkas, Underwood depot used to turn out two or three Regent IIs on Saturday mornings when the service frequency was doubled. The transmission sound of a crash gearbox Regent II was sheer music. With regard to MGO’s purchase of Bristols, as I understand it the company was part of the Balfour Beatty Group. However, anticipating wholesale bus nationalisation (which didn’t actually materialise), they sold out voluntarily to the British Transport Commission. Their first foray into the Bristol marque was a series of (I think) 15 KSW6G’s in 1952. (They also tried out the prototype Lodekka – a strange and ugly contraption with a very wide exposed radiator.)
Stephen Ford
Strictly speaking, Balfour Beatty were nationalised because they were an electricity generator (for their Notts and Derby’s trolleybuses). They were handed over to THC/Tilling as a result of this. They would happily have continued with AEC/Weymann otherwise.
David Oldfield
(They also tried out the prototype Lodekka – a strange and ugly contraption with a very wide exposed radiator.) I had to have a wry smile at the above comment, which is admittedly basically true I suppose. What many don’t realise though is that it didn’t have the equally revolutionary “Lodekka” body, but rather a modified version of the standard postwar product – recognition of this feature perhaps being eclipsed by the dramatic radiator and bonnet etc. Eventually joining West Yorkshire Road Car Co. Ltd as 822, it was renumbered with the rest of the fleet and ended its days as DX1. Ugly duckling it may have been, but it was the first practical model to abolish the awkward offside upper saloon gangway and poor headroom, and the notorious nearside leaning and rolling on cambers.
Chris Youhill
The KSW’s mentioned were delivered to Notts & Derby as replacements for the BUT trolleybuses which came off service during 1953. The prototype Lodekka was never owned by the company but spent a while with them on a trial basis however this did start a long relationship with Bristol/ECW right through to the demise (almost) of the MGO group in the 1970’s. Indeed the very last Lodekka (YNU 351G) became part of the fleet in the Autumn of 1968 and after continued service with Trent passed directly into preservation in 1980 where it still is – I was one of the original owners.
Paul D Chambers
23/03/11 – 06:50
The Barton’s low bridge decker looks like one of there NCME Regent V with the wrap around front windows a very smart looking design.
Roger Broughton
23/03/11 – 20:03
I remember these Regents with great affection and I was privileged to travel on them as a young lad! There were three batches, the MRB’s as shown were delivered new to Midland General, then the JVO’s, some of which were transferred from Mansfield District to Notts & Derby as trolleybus replacements and of course the last, the ONU’s which were lowbridge. It’s always slightly annoyed me when these ones are referred to as RLH type Regents, I’ve always felt that London Transport’s RLH’s should be described as ‘Midland General type Regents!’ The most memorable thing about all of them was the astonishing condition in which they were maintained, some of them achieved almost twenty years service and they were always turned out in pristine condition right till the end. In their later years, there was a concentration of them at Ilkeston garage, for use on the frequent town services which involved a stiff climb up the main street with many stops and high loadings, a task which they performed with consummate ease, much better than a lumbering Lodekka! In fact, I think it wasn’t until the arrival of the semi-automatic FLF6LX Bristols that the management of MGO thought they had anything capable of replacing them.
Chris Barker
24/03/11 – 06:37
You are right about the RLHs Chris (which of course were actually diverted from MGO). Similarly, the Regent IIs which tend to get called STLs. Goodness – LT only had 20 of them. Plenty more went elsewhere, and they were about as different from proper STLs as chalk from cheese! As for the Ilkeston town services (A2 and A3) I seem to remember some of the N&DT KSW6Gs being used, in the early 60s, when they had been displaced by Lodekkas from the Nottingham – Ripley B1. I guess it was the pre-selector gearbox on the Regents that made them favourites with Bath Street hill to contend with in one direction and Nottingham Road in the other.
Stephen Ford
21/01/14 – 06:54
I hope I’m correct in this statement but Bristol double deckers where not in service at the Midland General until after 1957 to 1958…. I used to work at Underwood garage 1973 to 76, and used to drive the old deckers both with Gardner engines and also with Bristol engines, these where brutes to the brain, left arm and the hearing at times when missing a gear the right leg also suffered due to the throttle being connected direct to the governor in the fuel pump.
Murray Bacon
21/01/14 – 09:09
The LW and early LX series of Gardner engines had ‘all speed’ governors which worked by setting the maximum engine speed at a level determined by the accelerator position. Pressing the throttle pedal to increase the revs acted against the resistance of the governor setting, and resulted in a heavy pedal action. When changing gear upwards with a conventional clutch/gearbox transmission, it paid to blip the engine slightly to take the load off the governor once the gear had engaged before releasing the clutch again to take up power. This obviated the tendency to jerk when the throttle pedal gave way suddenly under foot pressure.
Roger Cox
22/01/14 – 06:37
Murray, you may be right so far as Underwood was concerned, but I think Langley Mill had Bristol Lodekkas earlier than 1957. I’m almost certain they were running on the Hucknall – Alfreton C9 by 1956 at the latest. And of course there were the 15 earlier Bristol KSWs, that were actually Notts & Derby rather than MGO, which came in 1953.
Stephen Ford
22/01/14 – 14:06
Midland General’s first Lodekkas were actually delivered in 1954. One early use of them was on service 44, Derby – Chesterfield which had been instituted in that year and was regarded as a ‘flagship’ route so Alfreton garage may have had some of the first LD’s.
Chris Barker
22/01/14 – 17:56
For reference, the first Lodekka prototype LHY 949 is here www.sct61.org.uk/
John Darwent
25/01/14 – 08:12
Thanks for the link to the photos of prototype Lodekka LHY 949 John. Stephen’s earlier comments about the Lodekka prototype being a “strange and ugly contraption with a very wide exposed radiator” are, as Chris Y notes, basically true. However, if one looks at the ECW bodywork fitted to both prototypes, even though they were of differing styles, they were still quite attractive – as long as you didn’t stray around to the front end (Oooof!). It is well documented that the pair of Lodekka prototypes used some parts from the two prototype M-type chassis exhibited at the 1948 Commercial Motor Show. Intended as a beefed-up K-type with export markets in mind, the M-type was to have been available in double-deck (MD) or single deck (MS) form, and with either a Bristol AVW or Gardner LW engine, but it never went into production. Externally the main parts transferred over to the prototype Lodekkas appear to have been the wide radiators, chrome bumpers, bonnet assemblies, front mudguards and headlamps. The wide radiator did neither of the Lodekkas any favours, and the kindest comment I have read to date called it “ungainly”. Considering the overall attractiveness of the bodywork, the ‘set back’ look of the cab in relation to the radiator, mudguards and bumper simply jars. Most un-Bristol/ECW-like. Going back to Midland General Stephen, the prototype Lodekka demonstrated to the Company, plus Mansfield District and Notts & Derby, was West Yorkshire’s 822 (JWT 712).
