Tag: Harrington

E J Deeble, Liskeard – Leyland Tiger Cub – MMR 553 – 4

E J Deeble Liskeard
1955
Leyland PSUC1/2
Harrington C41C

E J Deeble operated some local services in the Liskeard area of Cornwall. In June 1978 this coach originally owned by Silver Star, Porton Down who sold out to Wilts and Dorset in the 1960s was operating a service outside Liskeard Railway Station – a commendable bus/rail link. Note the raised front headboard above the destination boxes where the Silver Star motif was originally fitted. This bus can’t have been ideal for local service work because of its centre entrance.

Photograph and Copy contributed by Ian Wild

04/05/20 – 05:52

This coach and its Silver Star fellow appears elsewhere on OBP: www.old-bus-photos.co.uk/

Roger Cox

05/05/20 – 05:54

I have been interested in this operator since I first saw a picture of 2 of their Leylands, a Cub and Comet in the book ‘Buses in Camera South West’ by Norman Aish, published in 1977. About 25 odd years ago returning from Cornwall to the Midlands I decided to take detour to Upton Cross, there I found in a Portacabin office a Mr Deeble who explained to me he was the son of the founder. He went on to chat about the company saying where ever possible they bought Leylands . He also related the story of a new Comet chassis that was shipped to a local bodybuilder (non PSV, I can’t remember the name). When the vehicle was complete it was found to be too tall to exit the building. The answer was to remove the wheels and drag the vehicle out on its hubs! (I have no idea if this is true but it is what I was told). Mr Deeble also said that the single vehicle garage next door, was not only built by his father, but he made the bricks as well! I could have chatted for ages but as my wife was waiting patiently in the car I decided it best to resume my journey to the Midlands. So a random detour proved very successful on that occasion.

John Rentell

06/05/20 – 07:21

Further to my post above concerning the Deeble Leyland Comet with a locally built body I have come across the following details in a list kindly supplied by Roger Grimley some years ago.MRL 910, Leyland Comet with a 33 seat Mashford body new on 5/50 and withdrawn on 5/71 after accident damage. As I have not heard of Mashford previously I am wondering if this is the vehicle Mr Deeble was referring to as a local body builder. If anyone has a picture I’d love to see it.

John Rentell

06/05/20 – 07:23

On the hubs? That’s nothing: //archive.commercialmotor.com

Martin Ingle

07/05/20 – 06:42

John R, no picture, I’m afraid, but apparently Mashford Brothers were boat builders who had a go at building coaches for a while. They were/are based in Cremyll, Cornwall and it seems they are still in business today as boat repairers.

Chris Barker

08/05/20 – 06:19

John, there’s a photo of MRL 910 (when past its best) on flickr – https://flic.kr/p/RMTprx  – new to Deeble 5/50. According to James Taylor in his book A-Z of British Bus Bodies, Mashford built six bodies at their boatyard at Cremyll, two in 1948, two in 1949 and two in 1955. The first two were Bedford OB, ECO 746 and ECO 997 for Millbrook Steamboat and Trading Company. The remaining four are captured by photographs on flickr. MRL 764, Austin for Hawkey, Wadebridge – https://flic.kr/p/xXkkAf  MRL 910 as above and URL 838/9 for Willis, Bodmin – https://flic.kr/p/xYtRjG 

David Williamson

10/05/20 – 06:52

David, thank you for sending these links. When the first Mashford body appeared on my screen I was not sure what to expect, however I think they look pretty good, identifiable by there own style side flashes. The Deeble Comet looks to have suffered serious damage to the off-side front, so understandably it was withdrawn, but apart from that it looks OK for a 20+ year old motor. If I can just master printing from FLICKR I can add these shots to my lists of these operators.

John Rentell

Mexborough & Swinton – Leyland Royal Tiger – OUF 834 – 103


Copyright John Stringer

Mexborough & Swinton Traction Co Ltd
1954
Leyland Royal Tiger PSU1/11
Harrington Wayfarer  C26C

Mexborough & Swinton acquired a number of former Southdown vehicles during the 1960’s, including this Royal Tiger with Harrington Wayfarer coachwork.  New to Southdown in 1954 as its 834, it was one of a batch (830-834) of five Royal Tigers with Harrington Wayfarer C26C coachwork.  However, whereas 830-833 were 8ft wide PSU1/15 models, 834 was a one-off 7ft 6in wide PSU1/11 model. Renumbered 1834 around 1960 it was used principally on the Brighton to Heysham part of their Irish tours.  It was acquired by M&STC in 1965, and withdrawn by them shortly after this photo was taken in 1968.

Photograph and Copy contributed by John Stringer

03/02/13 – 13:22

C26C leaps out as being rather odd, but the copy reveals why the batch was seated thus. Any ideas, please, as to why this one was only 7ft 6in, when the other four were to the usual 8ft? Could it, perhaps, have been because of the need to visit parts of Ireland where a standard 8ft vehicle could have problems – but the copy mentions only the Brighton to Heysham portion of the tour, as if an operator from across the Irish Sea dealt with the rest. Interesting!!!

Pete Davies

03/02/13 – 13:24

Thanks John for the excellent picture. 1832 and 1833 were also 7′ 6” PSU1/11’s and were used for the Irish leg of these tours by UTA until return to Southdown in 1963. They were subsequently painted in the Blue and Cream livery of Bucks Coaches of Worthing, who had just been taken over by Southdown. These vehicles replaced a pair of Bedford OB’s inherited from Bucks. 1832 and 1833 were withdrawn by Southdown in late 1966.

Roy Nicholson

03/02/13 – 14:21

It is interesting to note that 1832 and 1833 were sold to UTA in order to run the Southdown “coach cruises”, never tours, that ran in Northern Ireland. Regulations in the province permitted only UTA to run PSVs. They were transferred at book value, with the agreement that they would be bought back when no longer required.
At least Wallace Arnold and Barton had the same arrangement.

Pat Jennings

Berresford Motors – Leyland Royal Tiger – HWV 793

Berresford Motors - Leyland Royal Tiger - HWV 793

Berresford Motors Ltd (Cheddleton)
1952
Leyland Royal Tiger PSU1/15
Harrington Contender C41C (1956)

Berresford’s ex Wilts and Dorset (originally Silver Star, Porton Down) Royal Tiger rounds the perimeter road of Longton Bus Station on 20th June 1971. This coach was new to Silver Star in July 1952 with a Leyland C41C body as built in large numbers for Ribble. It was fitted with the Harrington Contender Mk IV body in July 1956 after a serious accident earlier that year. It passed to Wilts and Dorset in June 1963 when that Company took over Silver Star’s operations. This information is taken from a series of articles on Silver Star in Buses Illustrated from February to April 1965.
Jim Berresford operated a mixed collection of second hand vehicles from his premises at Cheddleton. HWV is showing “Private” on the blind but it could just as well have been operating on Berresford”s Longton – Leek service.
A collection of contemporary PMT buses are in the background. One of the final (1962) batch of Atlanteans of Stoke Depot on a Longton – Newcastle Estates working pursues HWV into the bus station whilst farebox fitted Roadliner 1063 of Longton Depot awaits its next trip to Blurton. Just in view is short Leopard 1124, another Longton allocated bus.

Photograph and Copy contributed by Ian Wild

10/11/13 – 08:02

If I remember rightly, Berresford’s was a bit of a rough and ready operation famous for it’s bus grave yard – old buses were simply dumped, withdrawn, in adjacent fields. They were big Leyland fans and had a number of ex Stockport all Leyland PD2s.

David Oldfield

10/11/13 – 17:33

This Harrington body was a variant of the type seen here on this site:
Maidstone & District – AEC Reliance – TKM 329 – C329 .
The Silver Star version seen above is rendered even uglier than the M&D style, in my opinion, by the grotesque front grilles that seemed to anticipate some of the later aberrations from the Duple stable. Thankfully, Harrington went on to redeem itself with the stylish Cavalier.

Roger Cox

11/11/13 – 08:31

The whole frontal appearance makes the body a potential Ugly Bus Page contender.

Phil Blinkhorn

11/11/13 – 15:32

I’ve seen this vehicle described as a Contender before, but surely it is a Wayfarer III? As far as I know the Contender model was for semi-chassisless vehicles such as the Commer-Harrington TS3s. However, for many years the LDB registered Harrington coaches delivered to North Western in 1958 were described in enthusiast publications as “Contenders” rather than Wayfarer IVs which is what they actually were! In that case the error went unchallenged until the vehicles had already been sold by NWRCC. Do we have any Harrington experts on board who can clarify this?

Neville Mercer

11/11/13 – 15:32

And the coach wears a sad face to express its own thoughts on its appearance, Phil.

Chris Hebbron

11/11/13 – 15:33

The body is a Harrington Wayfarer Mk 3, rather than a Contender, which was Harrington’s integral model fitted normally with a Rootes TS3 two stroke engine, apart from some for BOAC which had Rolls Royce petrol engines. The Wayfarer Mk 3 is described here:- www.thcoachwork.co.uk/way3.htm .

David Williamson

12/11/13 – 16:33

Maidstone & District had a large fleet of centre entrance Wayfarer/Reliances but also 3 similar looking but front entranced Commers, all of which were “TKM” registered.

Malcolm Boyland

13/11/13 – 12:54

You could say that Berresfords was a rough and ready operation but what a fascinating one! I always loved a trip from Leek to Hanley on the 16, or to Longton on the 106 because you really didn’t know what delight from the fleet would turn up next. I remember an ex-St Helens AEC Swift being on the stand in Longton bus station once and the driver couldn’t get reverse gear, all the passengers, some of whom were quite old, dutifully got off and helped to push the bus off the stand! It must be said though that everything Berresfords operated was smartly painted in fleet livery of red and ivory with the fleetname quite professionally applied. They were nearly always fitted with a destination blind of some sort. Such a shame that Jim Berresford’s untimely death brought it all to an end, it was one of those truly characterful operators which are sadly missed.

Chris Barker

10/12/13 – 06:38

Recent contributors may be interested to know that my book, Berresfords Motors of Cheddleton, is due to be published this week by MDS Books/Venture Publishing.

Eric Wain

11/12/13 – 06:30

Yes indeed Eric, I enquired about it at last Saturday’s Transport fair at the Manchester Museum. This is one volume I’m really looking forward to!

Chris Barker

23/12/13 – 08:34

I’ve just finished reading Eric’s book and can heartily recommend it. A decent history of Berresfords has been needed for donkey’s years and Eric has finally come up with the goods – and I would still be saying that even if we didn’t share a publisher!

Neville Mercer

03/03/14 – 07:26

Eric, I have just purchased and read your superb book on Berresfords, an operator that has long fascinated me (and no doubt many other enthusiasts) even though I only visited the depot a couple of times. A couple of points – you don’t mention in the book the large number of vehicles which must have been purchased for spares only, on both my visits a lot of the derelict buses seemed to fall into that category but I doubt there is any record. Amongst others the “West’s” RTL, and on my second visit a Western SMT Fleetline, GMT ex North Western RE and several ex NBC single deckers. My second query is how did Jim decide on withdrawal whether to keep a vehicle round the back for spares, or sell it on either for service or scrap. And whilst many obviously stayed in the yard for years, other derelicts must have been disposed of long before the PMT takeover.

Michael Keeley

20/05/14 – 08:30

Thank you, gentlemen, for your kind comments regarding my book. With regard to the withdrawn vehicles and those purchased for spares, there were two reasons why this aspect could not be covered. Given the large number of vehicles which fell into these categories over the years, it became obvious that other text or photos within the book would have to be forfeited in view of space limitations. Secondly, although there was much information available about many vehicles acquired for spares etc., it was known that the list would certainly be far from complete and it was decided not to produce an incomplete list.
From the early 1950s some vehicles withdrawn from the fleet were cannibalised and the bodies cut up rather than sold on. Some vehicles acquired for spares were treated similarly, whereas others donated useful major units and other parts and then were used for parts storage. One double-decker bought in 1949 actually donated its staircase which was incorporated into the rear of the extension of the office and workshop block! Unfortunately, I did not become aware of this until the book had been published.

Eric Wain

Black & White – Leyland Leopard – DDG 256C – 256

Black & White - Leyland Leopard - DDG 256C - 256

Black & White Motorways
1965
Leyland Leopard PSU3/3R
Harrington C47F

DDG 256C is a Leyland Leopard with Harrington coachwork, in the fleet of Black & White Motorways of Cheltenham. We see her at Southampton Coach Station – the “real” one in Bedford Place – on 22 August 1970. She’s on an Associated Motorways (remember?) service to Derby.

Photograph and Copy contributed by Pete Davies

03/01/16 – 10:44

256, Black & White/A M, Harrington. She would have been on the cross country service via Oxford that ran with connexions at Oxford with the Northampton – Bournemouth service crewed by outbased drivers.

Mike

07/01/16 – 08:36

If the Derby destination is correct, a check of the Associated Motorways timetable suggests this is more likely to be operating a summer Saturday journey which used the M5 and kept through traffic out of Cheltenham. It’s 09:34 from Portsmouth, 11:15 Southampton to Derby for 19:50. Non-stop from Southampton to Kidderminster apart from a halt at Strensham services.
I don’t think Derby was served off the daily Oxford “mini interchange” – just Northampton and Nottingham by further connection.

Mike Grant

19/01/16 – 10:19

The timetable and the fare chart, where two things. The fare chart had routes that we could combine, often services, that include a mileage charge to be paid to Western/Southern National or other operators for running at peak times on their routes. This was so one coach would take the overloads for a couple of routes, often to cover holiday fortnights. At certain time of the year seasoned travellers would apply by post for tickets on direct coaches, from their area to the coast.
Then one Saturday morning the wrong charts got printed, instead of route instructions being printed direct night service via Cheltenham ere printed. The police where not to happy, we brought Cheltenham to a stand still at 01:00 in the morning, private operators who did the same work for years made their only visit to Cheltenham to be told to go away. We did have a few deckers turn up with overloads or taxis, one decker came up from Bridgewater, when we thought we had got rid of it it turned up at 03:30, on the night service driven by a fitter with another overload, or the Red and White with 9 taxis following who wanted paying there and then.
Monday morning when the traffic manager and the accountant went through the cash books the duty clerk and inspector had some explaining to do, or why they booked 7 rooms at Carrs Hotel for Ribble/Yorkshire Traction drivers who came down on overloads from various points who expected to return straight away only for us to use their dps to move the passengers on.

Mike

19/01/16 – 15:47

Yes, the Derby destination is correct. This entry on the blind shows quite clearly on my original, but please, nobody ask me to translate the windscreen sticker!

Pete Davies

Ellen Smith Tours – Leyland Leopard – CDK 448C

Ellen Smith Tours - Leyland Leopard - CDK 448C
CDK 448C_2

Ellen Smith’s Tours (Rochdale)
1965
Leyland Leopard PSU3/3R
Harrington C49F

CDK 448C is quite clearly a 1965 Leyland Leopard with Harrington body, as seen in the first view. She is of the PSU3/3R variety although some sources have her as a PSU3/3RT, while the seating is of the C49F layout. She is seen at the Harrington Event at Amberley on 3 June 2012. There has been some discussion in these pages about the resemblance of the leaping cat badge seen in the second view to the Royal Tiger badge on the front of Leyland’s product. Indeed, the company history, as set out by Eric Ogden, comments thus:
“The striking Leaping Tiger crest applied to the sides of the coaches, first in a triangle and then in a circle, appeared in the early 1930s on the Leyland Tigers. It is said that the first hand-painted image was copied from a cigarette card. This skilful freehand painting was carried out by Jack Mills who was trained as a professional painter. The design was used by Leyland as the badge for the Royal Tiger coach from 1949. The same design was used as the sign for the Royal Tiger pub in Leyland.”
The device faces forward on both sides, so Leyland must have used that on the offside of the Ellen Smith vehicles.

Photograph and Copy contributed by Pete Davies

10/01/16 – 10:54

CDK 448C_3

Thanks to Pete Davies for his posting. I had wondered about the side logo since taking a few shots of this splendid vehicle at the Bus Meet-Bewdley 2013. I would be very interested in future posts relating to its history.

Nigel Edwards

11/01/16 – 06:51

What a great coach of the era, they were far better built and did not rattle in later life.

Mike

11/01/16 – 09:24

Thank you, Nigel and Mike. I’ve wondered at intervals over the years which were the better-built vehicles, Duple, Harrington or Plaxton. Of course, I know that will provoke some comment on here!!!!!

Pete Davies

11/01/16 – 13:39

There were a couple of glimpses of an Ellen Smith coach at the end of Endeavour last night. Is this the only one in livery? And would it have worked in the Oxford area in period?

John Lomas

11/01/16 – 13:40

This lovely coach appeared towards the end of an episode of ‘Endeavour’ on ITV Sunday 10 January 2015.
Note that in the photograph the coach carries an ‘On hire to Yelloway’ window label. I have seen various photographs of the coach with this addition. However, it is perhaps the strangest item in respect of 1960s/1970s authenticity one can have on an Ellen Smith’s coach. Both Ellen Smith and Yelloway heralded from the Lancashire town of Rochdale and were great competitors. Hubert Allen and Harry Smith got together to discuss matters of mutual benefit or business interest but that was the extent of it. During my time at Yelloway in the late 1960s/early 1970s there was never any inter-hiring as far as I can recall. They did, in later years, participate in a joint service to Morecambe.
I recall on a number of occasions when I worked at Yelloway being sent over to Newgate to furtively spy on Ellen’s excursion departures see if their loadings looked better than ours. What was a little irritating to me as I did my absolute best at playing an undercover spy was that most of the passengers recognised me and gave me a wave as they went by!

David Slater

11/01/16 – 13:40

Pete. You have to factor in chassis as well. Flexing chassis can distort even the best built body. I have a Harrington on a PS1 which while sumptuous is quite a rattlebox yet my friend has same body on a PS2 and it is rock solid

Roger Burdett

11/01/16 – 16:03

Even Mrs B noticed the coach on the TV last night. Whilst an excursion may have taken one of Smith’s coaches into Morse territory, the use of the coach in the context of the programme’s plot did not fit.
A shame really as the previous week the use of two preserved Oxford double deckers was very much in context.

Phil Blinkhorn

11/01/16 – 16:05

You noticed, David! I wondered who would be first. I thought it a bit of an oddity when I saw the sticker. I can’t tell from Nigel’s view whether it appears there or not.
Interesting comment, Roger! I’d have thought there might be a difference between, say, AEC and Guy affecting the way the body moved or didn’t, but I wouldn’t have expected it between models from the same line. Ah well, We live and learn!

Pete Davies

11/01/16 – 16:06

For me Pete, all through my driving days I aspired to one day having charge of a Harrington, be it AEC or Leyland no matter! It never happened . .
I agree with Roger, the rattles depend a great deal on Chassis, a Duple on a R226 SO different to an AEC or Leyland. My personal pet hate was a Yeates – always seemed to leak around the myriad rubber window seals.

Nigel Edwards

12/01/16 – 05:51

I doubt that Ellen Smith vehicles would have visited the Oxford area on any regular basis as most of their operations were in the north west. They did a good deal of business in the winter months running supporter’s coaches for the away games of Rochdale Hornets. They also provided the team coach, complete with distinctive headboard for many years. Many’s the trip I made across Lancashire and Yorkshire to far flung destinations such as Dewsbury, Batley, Leigh, Widnes and numerous other rugby league playing towns. It was usually on one of the earlier Cavalier bodied 36ft Leopards. The fleet was always immaculately turned out and the fares were always very reasonable. A truly quality operation.

Philip Halstead

12/01/16 – 08:22

I made a day trip with Ellen Smith from Rochdale to the 1974 Commercial Motor Show at Earl’s Court. The transport was a Plaxton Panorama Elite-bodied Leyland Leopard. The main thing I remember is the rather low back seats which were a bit of a surprise for such a long trip, although they were more than bus seats.

David Beilby

20/01/16 – 09:21

The latest episode of Endevour had a Burlingham Seagull coach in a red and blue livery dropping a character off in central Oxford. Sadly it was too far away to see what it was.

Chris Hough

20/01/16 – 17:13

The Seagull was the preserved Whittles of Kidderminster Seagull on a Leyland Tiger Cub chassis owned by Bernard Rodgers of Bewdley. His standard of presentation is always top class and it could be argued looked too good for the role of delivering passengers back from holidays.

Roger Burdett

Ribble – Leyland Leopard – PCK 618 – 1036

Ribble - Leyland Leopard - PCK 618 - 1036

Ribble Motor Services
1961
Leyland Leopard L2T
Harrington Cavalier C32F

This Leyland Leopard L2 with Harrington Cavalier C32F body was new to Ribble in 1961. The low seating capacity means it was one of the touring fleet. I do have a query about the chassis designation, because some of my sources mention a twin-speed rear axle, meaning it would be L2T. Any thoughts, please, folks? The coach is seen at the Harrington event at Amberley on 3 June 2012.

Ribble - Leyland Leopard - PCK 618 - 1036

Here we have an interior view of the vehicle which was taken courtesy of the owner.

Photograph and Copy contributed by Pete Davies

24/03/16 – 05:58

Primrose Valley Coaches of Filey had PCK 616. I enjoyed driving it and its two speed axle, and only 32 luxury seats.

Ken Wragg

24/03/16 – 17:03

I became misty eyed looking at this photo as an avid admirer of Harrington’s Cavalier and Grenadier designs and there is a tantalising glimpse of one of Southdown’s near identical extended tour Leopards alongside, these were definitely L2Ts.The main differences were the 27 reclining seats in 2+1 layout and the glazed cove panels and they too were a delight to drive although I only drove them after they were up seated for normal coach duties. My drooling at least won’t show on an e-mail.

Diesel Dave

25/03/16 – 14:22

Thank you, Dave and Ken, for confirming the L2T version. Dave, the adjacent Southdown was 2722 CD and the blue and cream one parked back-to-back with PCK 618 was Hawkey’s 100 VRL. I have views of both, if you’d like me to forward via Peter.

Pete Davies

26/03/16 – 05:18

PMT acquired three of this batch in 1972 as Roadliner replacements, PCK601, 602 and 605. These were C41F as acquired. They did four seasons with PMT before withdrawal in 1976. I remember them as very sound, reliable coaches. Does anyone have photos of them in PMT service?

Mr Anon

26/03/16 – 05:19

Pete, Like Diesel Dave I tend to glaze over and dribble when a Harrington appears . . they truly are icons of an age when these machines shouted style and quality, sadly missed. I for one would appreciate a peek at your shots of 2722 CD and 100 VRL.

Nigel Edwards

26/03/16 – 16:54

Here is PCK on coaching duties with PMT www.flickr.com/photos/

Stephen Bloomfield

27/03/16 – 07:33

2722 CD
100 VRL
100 VRL_2

Nigel Edwards comments that he would like to see views of 2722 CD and  100 VRL.

Pete Davies

27/03/16 – 09:58

These photos only reinforce my long-held view that Harrington’s Cavalier/Grenadier bodies seemed to look stylish in virtually ANY livery!

Chris Hebbron

27/03/16 – 17:39

Many thanks to Pete Davies for posting the three extra photos of 2722 CD and 100 VRL as looking at them made me all misty eyed and nostalgic and quite weak at the knees.
It is also good to see 2722 CD in the original livery with the cream roof unfortunately this only lasted 2 or 3 years before being painted green this was long before it was reseated as it is now. The armchair reclining seats from these and the later 1800-44 Leopard PSU3’s were distributed to the various staff canteens and rest rooms for the benefit of drivers numb parts and were much appreciated.

Diesel Dave

Scarlet Coaches – Leyland Comet – MYA 590

Scarlet Coaches - Leyland Comet - MYA 590

Scarlet Coaches (Minehead)
1950
Leyland Comet CPP1
Harrington C29F

Here we have another wonderful example of how a coat of paint can make such a difference to the way almost anything can appear. MYA 590 is a Leyland Comet CPP1 with Harrington C29F body. In the first view, it is in the livery of Scarlet Coaches of Minehead, and it is in the Southsea rally on 17 June 1984.

Scarlet Coaches - Leyland Comet - MYA 590

In this second view, it has been repainted blue and cream to star alongside Joan Hickson in the ‘Miss Marple’ film, Nemesis. This view was captured at Netley on 12 July 1987.

Photograph and Copy contributed by Pete Davies

09/03/17 – 07:02

I seem to remember that, during the 1950s, the livery change between the top colour and the lower was achieved by a ‘blend’ of the two colours down the rear corner panels.
This was fashionable at the time, although must have been incredibly difficult to achieve. Virtually impossible to achieve with brush painting, so presumably the gradual change from the light colour to the dark might have been a way of showing off the ‘new spray painting’ technique.
It’s not a feature I have seen on any currently preserved coaches, but this picture of the unnatural hard line between the two colours has sparked the memory of this old style.
Anybody else remember it?

Petras409

10/03/17 – 17:39

Can anyone suggest why, given Leyland’s good name, the Comet was not more popular? Did the Tiger Cub sweep it away?

Ian Thompson

11/03/17 – 07:23

Pure guesswork on my part Ian. The Comet was a very successful commercial vehicle chassis, with production continuing through the forward control LAD and ergomatic cabs in both rigid and artic unit form. However, it gave coach bodybuilders less design scope, and lower seating capacity than the under floor chassis of a Royal Tiger or Tiger Cub

Ronnie Hoye

12/03/17 – 07:45

Thanks, folks!

Pete Davies

12/03/17 – 07:46

The Comet wasn’t in the same market as the underfloor-engined chassis. As a lightweight with a seating capacity probably limited to 32, it was competing with the Bedford OB and Albion Victor. It’s likely to have been more expensive than both, and didn’t really offer anything extra.

Peter Williamson

13/03/17 – 16:32

Later passenger variants of the Comet were forward control but aimed primarily for export. There was a Duple bodied ECPO12/2T in preservation once, this was one of a handful sold on the home market, the Albion Victor and the SB, particularly with a Leyland Engine, not to mention the Ford and Commer alternatives made it a non-starter over here although it was very popular in New Zealand with the Bedford SB8 and SB13 known as the “Poor Man’s Comet”.

Stephen Allcroft

16/08/17 – 07:10

MLL 803

With regard to the piece by Roger Cox, a photo showing Comet OPB 536 next to Wimbledon Coaches or Allco’s RF 266 (MLL 803) taken at Cobham Bus Museum has recently appeared on my son Simon’s Facebook page, but I can find no further mention of it in preservation, unless anyone knows better!

Dave Kriesler

11/02/18 – 06:28

Thanks for the picture of MYA 590. It used to be parked in the open near the sea front in Minehead between tours, and must have been the best polished commercial vehicle I have ever seen. You could always see your face in it. The owner must have spent every night polishing, because I never saw any work being done on it during the day. Glad it ended up making popular films – it really deserved to be seen, even if in different livery.
Scarlets was a small company with usually only one bus – as far as I know, except when one was replaced and they ran two – perhaps just for a summer season. My brother suggests that in 1982-83 the Royal Veterinary College used a Scarlet bus which sounds very like MYA 590 to transport a student running team to Holland (in both years).

Sorry to go on, but your page has got me going. I have been reminded that Scarlet Pimpernel of Minehead and Blue coaches of Porlock (both with a single vehicle, it seems) merged in 1954, and continued until about 1970. Both Vehicles are now in Coventry, MYA 590 in Pimpernel livery and its stable mate (JYC 855) in Scarlet and Blue. (latest picture/record I have found is 2017 (of JYC)) With a 20 year career of summer day tripping over Exmoor (including the famous Countisbury Hill into Lynmouth) and winter theatre trips to Bristol, Bath and Weston Super Mare etc, shows the quality of these vehicles especially as there was no back up if one broke down.They still seem to make regular trips down to the London Bus Museums open day at Brooklands in April, possibly under their own steam?

Huw Jones

11/02/18 – 08:40

It is just JYC that is based in Coventry MYA being in Surrey I think.
There is another Scarlet Motors Harrington on an AEC chassis complete in Bromsgrove but the owner has not taken it out for several years.
There is a Blue Motors Harrington Bodied Cheetah based in Sussex.
MYA+JYC last got together in 2015 or 2016 at Brooklands in their Harrington/Weymann anniversary get together.
JYC is on the road every two years and 2018 is an on the road year. Only confirmed appearance is in the Oct Isle of Wight Beer & Buses Weekend.

Roger Burdett

05/01/19 – 06:42

I have a few photos of the AEC Roger when for a short period it was owned by Howard Homer. Unfortunately the lighting wasn’t very good as it was undercover, this would have been in the 90s.

William Parker

Blue Motors – Leyland Cheetah – EYA 923

Blue Motors - Leyland Cheetah - EYA 923
Blue Motors - Leyland Cheetah - EYA 923

Blue Motors
1939
Leyland Cheetah LZ5
Harrington C31F

EYA 923 was new in 1939. She is a Leyland Cheetah LZ5, with Harrington C31F body, complete with the tailfin, and we see her at Amberley during the Harrington Gathering on 3 June 2012. Some confusion creeps in about her origins, as I have seen mentions in different places of Blue Motors of Minehead, Blue Motors of Porlock, and others, but the rear view of this magnificent vehicle should settle that!

Photograph and Copy contributed by Pete Davies

09/11/15 – 06:52

Harringtons were one of those coachbuilders who produced bodywork with a curved waistrail which fell away sharply towards the rear end, as amply demonstrated here. Am I correct in thinking I’ve read somewhere that one of the functions of the dorsal fin, if not it’s main purpose, was to provide a little extra headroom for passengers who wished to access the rear seats?

Chris Barker

09/11/15 – 08:54

You may be right, Chris, and thank you for your comment. My understanding has always been that it was associated with ventilation.

Pete Davies

10/11/15 – 07:38

Yes, that is my understanding too.. Not apparent here, it widens out as it joins the roofline providing space for a head! Ventilation is a secondary function. Porlock Weir, Blue Motors base, is just outside Minehead, so it would appear that Minehead, out of which excursions were operated aids those without detailed geographical knowledge! Unusually there is no phone no, but when the coach first entered service, there weren’t many phones . . .

Philip Lamb

10/11/15 – 07:39

Thomas Harrington applied for a patent on 5th November 1935, granted as 461026 in February 1937, for which the preamble said “It is usual nowadays to streamline motor coaches and one result of this is that difficulties are experienced in providing sufficient headroom along the central gangway, and an even more important consideration is the provision of adequate ventilation of motor road coaches which presents its special difficulties. The object of our inventor is to provide a motor coach of pleasing appearance which will also have more adequate ventilation and improved headroom and which will moreover lead itself to more effective internal lighting”.
The detailed specification went on describe how this was accomplished, and the diagram shows the familiar dorsal fin. So, Chris and Peter are both right !!

Peter Delaney

10/11/15 – 07:40

Those louvers would create a low pressure area thus drawing the stale air out from the back of the coach with fresh air entering from further forward (open windows or vents)

John Lomas

10/11/15 – 07:40

The Harrington Dorsal Fin was patented as a ventilation device but it also added headroom in mid gangway on designs such as this one. Nice to see it in such good condition.

Stephen Allcroft

10/11/15 – 15:39

I wonder just how suitable the Lynx chassis was for coach operations, normally well-filled with passengers, especially in the challenging byeways of North Devon. The TS8 would surely have been a better choice.

Chris Hebbron

11/11/15 – 07:17

Chris, various Bedfords and Fords (and other “lightweight” models) were the choice of many independent (and some “combine”) tour operators in later years. No doubt tour coaches were subject to less “stresses-and-strains” as they didn’t have to stop/start as frequently as service buses, nor were they subject to such prolonged “hammering” as express coaches. True, a Tiger might have romped up the Devon hills quicker – but is that what the punters would have paid their money for? And no doubt a Cheetah cost less up-front than a Tiger, and so could be replaced earlier in its life.

Philip Rushworth

11/11/15 – 16:27

With reference to what Chris and Philip were saying the worry for me would be going _down_ the Devon hills in a Cheetah. However it was fairly successful as a lightweight full-size coach within its limits, much more so than the AEC Regal II.

Stephen Allcroft

13/11/15 – 06:31

My chief fear would be to be going down the Devon hills pursued by a Cheetah…..

Rob McCaffery

13/11/15 – 13:29

Rob’s comment reminds me of the look on the face of one of the St Andrew’s Ambulance crew on the Sunday of Glasgow Vintage Vehicle Trust’s open weekend when I said I had to run as I had a Western Leopard to catch.

Stephen Allcroft

16/11/15 – 05:32

It is worth noting that the term “observation Coach” painted on the rear display of EYA 923 refers to another Harrington patented feature – a floor-line rising in steps towards the rear of the vehicle allowing passengers improved vision over the heads of those in forward seats. All coachwork styles with this feature were officially called called Observation Coach, while the style illustrated tended to be called a “Torpedo” to differentiate it from others. This attractive swooping waist rail design was not the most numerous of the immediate pre-war Harrington production and it strikes me was probably lighter, for although it was available on heavyweight chassis such as the AEC Regal, was most likely to be found on lighter ones, such as Leyland Cheetahs and Cubs.

Nick Webster

14/08/16 – 06:04

Blue Motors HQ and main garage was in North Road at Minehead, under what is now a block of flats. A small sub-depot existed at Porlock Weir, some 8 miles from Minehead and this building (which still stands) was capable of holding two of their vehicles. For a long period Blue Motors operated the Porlock Weir – Porlock – Minehead bus service hence the out-station.

Chris

16/01/19 – 07:33

I was put on a coach as a young lad with a tail-fin… at ‘The Bakers Arms’ Stratford in East London in the early fifties.
I don’t know where the Journey began but it stopped at the Bakers Arms above…then in Saffron Walden in Essex and I guess finished in Haverhill Suffolk.
I’m wondering if any other manufacture made a coach with a tail-fin as I always had the impression it was a Bedford coach.
Also have to say I think I thought it quite disappointing inside, not modern at all, also I’m sure the clock inside was Art Deco!! only a kids impression as it was about 67 years ago.

Ken Bradley

18/01/19 – 06:35

Looking at the Harrington Body numbers I can find no Dorsal Fins with a Bedford Chassis. They appear to be Leyland AEC Foden and Commer.

Roger Burdett

East Kent – Ford Thames 570E – TJG 440

East Kent - Ford Thames 570E - TJG 440

East Kent Road Car Co Ltd
1960
Ford Thames 570E
Harrington Crusader Mk1 C41F

East Kent Road Car Co Ltd. bought this smart unique vehicle into the fleet at the start of the 1960’s, this was a common sight with the coach touring fleets around the country but for East Kent, this was a one off. A Ford Thames Trader 570E #510E34629 with Harrington #2147 C41F body was new in January 1960 to supplement and update its excursion fleet (1xBedford OB; OKE 470 & 2x Bedford SB; GFN 600/1) on the Isle of Thanet, but this work began to wain and TJG 440 found itself regularly working the express runs to London. This vehicle was an elegant looking coach and stood out against the regular “boxlike” London express vehicles of the TFN & WFN batches which East Kent used at the time. This view taken in the works section at the back of Westwood depot, in pristine condition and ready for another excursion around the countryside depicted in “The Darling Buds of May”, the Garden of England.
What other rare, unusual or odd looking pictures of PSV’s do you have out there, I look forward to seeing some more very special photos.

Photograph and Copy contributed by Ron Mesure

26/01/15 – 06:31

This is certainly an interesting variation, Ron, of the ‘normal’ Cavalier body. I’ve never seen one like this, with a gentle slope forward of the emergency door.

Chris Hebbron

03/09/15 – 07:09

Thanks, lovely to see another old picture of my bus!

Steve

05/09/15 – 07:08

I’ve looked back at my records and have found that I saw this coach at Walton on the Naze on August 28th 1975 while it was with Viceroy but sadly I didn’t take a photo. Please don’t tell me that was forty years ago because that would make me feel very old.

Nigel Turner

01/12/19 – 07:39

I am really pleased to find out that this fine old bus still exists! She features in several East Kent books I have. What is her current state of preservation, and will she be back on the road in the future? I’m just an East Kent bus fan, and old vehicle enthusiast.

Robbie Robson

Southdown – Dennis Falcon – FUF 181 – 181

FUF 181

Southdown Motor Services
1939
Dennis Falcon P4
Harrington B30C

In 1938, Dennis replaced its multiplicity of of small buses for lightly trafficked routes – Dart, Pike, Arrow Minor, Ace and Mace – with one model, the Falcon. This was offered with normal or forward control, the engine options being Dennis 3.77 side valve petrol, or Gardner 4LK or Perkins P6 diesel. In 1938 Southdown took over the Worthing Tramocar business and began replacing the original Shelvoke and Drewry Freighters, at first with new Freighters. More about the Tramocar business may be found on OBP here:- //www.old-bus-photos.co.uk/?p=19218 
In April/May 1939 Southdown moved towards conventional buses for the Tramocar services, and purchased FUF 180/1, fleet nos. 80/1, two forward control Dennis Falcon P4s with Harrington B30C bodies offering easy access to the elderly clientele of Worthing. A third similar chassis, JUF 82, no. 82, but with Dennis B30R bodywork, arrived later that year in December after war had broken out, by which time only about 50 Falcons in total had been been produced by Dennis. In 1949 Southdown again turned to the lightweight Falcon P4, buying a further nine with Dennis B30R bodies, JUF 83-91 with matching fleet nos., for its service between Havant and Hayling Island which crossed a frail, elderly wooden bridge over the Langstone Channel built in 1824, on which a toll applied. Even then the bus went over tentatively and unladen, the passengers having to alight and walk across to rejoin it on the far side. The two ex Tramocar Falcons were transferred to the Hayling Island service to complement the ten later arrivals. The Langstone Bridge was replaced by a new structure in 1956, but the crossing toll remained until 1960. None of the Dennis bodied Falcons seems to have survived, but Harrington bodied FUF 181 of 1939 was once extant on the preservation scene. It is seen above at Brighton on the HCVC Rally in May 1970. Currently it is recorded as undergoing further restorative work. The prominent starting handles on all the Southdown Falcons suggests that they were powered by the robust 3.77 litre side valve petrol engine rather than the Gardner 4LK, but confirmation would be welcome.

Photograph and Copy contributed by Roger Cox

13/11/21 – 06:24

Hello Roger, I have just checked in Colin Druce’s excellent book ‘Southdown in Austerity’, and he confirms that these buses were indeed fitted with the Dennis 3.77 litre side valve petrol engine.

Roy Nicholson

01/03/22 – 06:47

I read with interest the notes on the captioned. I had been looking for any information regarding its present state, to date, to no avail. However despite my not being fully computer literate I managed to get the following, it is/was with Seaford & District who I understand have been taken over by 7 Sisters Bus & Coach whatever they might be in 01-2021. On the Seaford web site under Vintage Bus there is a Flickr Photopool, under Group Pool, Paul Goldsmith there is a shot of said bus, headed DCS_0105, dated 08/2017. It looks to be a VERY comprehensive works in progress, to say the least!. I should add that I have several times in the past sent E-mails to S&D regarding this vehicle but on no occasion did I get any reply, customer service?.

John Adrian Pearce